Cuffs.........

greenhorn · Post by **greenhorn** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 3:45 am

What are the "ribbons" on the cuff called, where they unit or individual awards.... I've seen photos of soldiers with Krim on.... is it a unit citation?

Christoph Awender · Post by **Christoph Awender** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:49 am

Hello!

I guess you mean the cuffbands (Ärmelband). There were several types of such bands. First were "honorary" titles for regiments e.g. Großdeutschland, Totenkopf etc.... names of Luftwaffe wings etc..
Another type was the campaign bands like Afrika, Kurland, Kreta etc.. which were given out to members of units involved in these fightings.
Another type were special purpose soldiers like Kriegsberichter (war correspondent), teachers of military schools, field police etc....
I don´t think that a armband "Krim" existed as this was given out as armshield.

\Christoph

greenhorn · Post by **greenhorn** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:41 am

Cheers Chris.

So in theory Chris you could have a war correspondent who was in Gross Deutschland, served in North Africa... with three Armelbands.....

I knew I had seen Krim somewhere, so was the armshield the equivalent to the Armelband, but for small engagements?

Christoph Awender · Post by **Christoph Awender** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 10:51 am

greenhorn wrote:Cheers Chris.

So in theory Chris you could have a war correspondent who was in Gross Deutschland, served in North Africa... with three Armelbands.....

I knew I had seen Krim somewhere, so was the armshield the equivalent to the Armelband, but for small engagements?

Yes, but Grossdeutschland would have had the armband on the right sleeve while the others would be on the left.
If a shield or a armband was surely not depending on the size of the battle but I don´t know the criteria why they gave out shields or armbands.

\Christoph

Nibelung · Post by **Nibelung** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:59 pm

Yes, but Grossdeutschland would have had the armband on the right sleeve while the others would be on the left.

Hi Christoph!

I'm only feeling confused with your above statement. I saw armbands with the unit name on the left sleeve of the recipient (like Adolf Hitler) in some SS photos.

I also saw a photo of Manteuffel with the armband Afrika and Grossdeutchland both on the right sleeve.

Can you explain this confusion please?

best regards,
Nibelung

John W. Howard · Post by **John W. Howard** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:15 pm

Hello Nibelung:
The Waffen SS wore their unit cufftitles on their left sleeve. Non-SS units wore their cufftitles on their right sleeve, thus Großdeutschland ( an elite Heer formation ) would wear their cufftitle on their right sleeve. Hence, Manteuffel with his Großdeutschland cufftitle on his right sleeve.
I hope this helped!!!!! Even I am getting confused!!!!!!!

Herr Doktor · Post by **Herr Doktor** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 8:30 pm

Maybe the ribbons you mentioned are for Der Spiess? These are two ribbons, just like the silver collar trim (tresse) for NCO's except these are worn on the cuff. There are two per cuff, they are on both sleeves. Unlike cuffbands, this insignia has no title printed on it. Der Spiess is the name for the highest-ranking non-commissioned officer in a company, usually a hauptfeldwebel. And this is what the insignia represents, worn in addition to any other cuffbands (placed over them).

The Heer wore these, it's a tradition going back to at least WWI. I don't recall whether the WSS wore them or not.

It does get complicated, doesn't it!

HD

Nibelung · Post by **Nibelung** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 6:44 am

Why would the armband Afrika worn on the right sleeve by Manteufell if there were to be worn on the left one?

BTW, thanks John!

best,
Nibelung

Christoph Awender · Post by **Christoph Awender** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 10:44 am

Nibelung wrote:Why would the armband Afrika worn on the right sleeve by Manteufell if there were to be worn on the left one?

BTW, thanks John!

best,
Nibelung

Who would approach Manteuffel and tell him he is wearing it on the wrong arm? He would probably don´t care. :-)
From about 30 photos of soldiers with Afrika cufftitle I know there a few worn on the right arm.

\Christoph

Nibelung · Post by **Nibelung** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:09 am

Thank you Christoph. Take care!

best,
Nibelung

awaygood · Post by **awaygood** » Sat Oct 23, 2004 1:15 am

To clear up the confusion....
'AFRIKA KORPS' cufftitle, issued in 1941, was issued to all members of the Afrika Korps (and Luftwaffe units serving in N Africa). It was worn on the right sleeve.
'AFRIKA' was an campaign award (issued in 1943). It was worn on the left sleeve.
As a general rule, for the German Army, regimental (etc.) titles (GrossDeutschland, Afrika Korps, etc.), were worn on the right sleeve, while award titles (for N Africa, Crete, etc.) were worn on the left sleeve.
Hope this helps........

Matt L · Post by **Matt L** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 12:33 am

Correct- so if there is indeed a picture of von Manteufel with a cufftitle other than his Großdeutschland on his right sleeve, I'd think it would have to have been the 'AFRIKAKORPS'unit' title, and the picture must have been taken before 15.3.1943- because it was on this date the 'AFRIKA' cufftitle, worn on the left sleeve, superceded the 'AFRIKAKORPS' title. The regulation position applied to everyone, and of anyone, I'd expect commanding Generals to get it right- especially since the General wouldn't sew it on himself; that would be the job of an orderly- someone who could be punished for getting it wrong.

I don't know of any particular reason for the choice of a cufftitle or a sleeve shield to recognize the participants of a battle, campaign, etc.- they were equal in meaning.

There were four cufftitles: KRETA , AFRIKA, METZ 1944, and KURLAND, and 5 shields: NARVIK, DEMJANSK, CHOLM, and LAPPLAND. Apparently there were plans for a couple of others- BALKAN and STALINGRAD- but these were never instituted. The WARSCHAU shield was instituted, but was never produced.

Matt

Feldgrau.net

Cuffs.........

Cuffs.........

Your Observations are Correct!!

Afrika Korps and Afrika Cuff Titles