translation from French to English

Marc Binazzi · Post by **Marc Binazzi** » Sat Apr 30, 2005 3:04 am

I have a question regarding the best way to translate from French to English the ceremony during which troops are handed over the "fourragere" (the dictionary suggests the same word).

Is an expression like "Fourragere awarding ceremony" correct or is there anything more suitable? This is meant for the English version of the Paris Police Department website, so I'd better not try anything inaccurate!

Thanks in advance to all contributors.

Christian · Post by **Christian** » Sat Apr 30, 2005 6:18 am

Marc,

I would under no circumstances translate "Fourragère" as it would become meaningless in English. This is the actual name of a military award and it should be kept that way. In fact, Webster's Collegiate Dictionary (11th edition), one of the best, includes the noun "Fourragère" and provides information on it.

Hope this helps and good luck with your translation

Cheers,

Christian

Rodger Herbst · Post by **Rodger Herbst** » Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:05 am

This is a little off,but does "whermacht" mean all the German armed forces,you hear it alot on tv when they're talking about the German army.I know that Heer refers to the army,luftwaffe to the airforce,etc.

KlemenL · Post by **KlemenL** » Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:23 am

Hi Marc!

Fourragere awarding ceremony

I believe the alternative to the Fourragere awarding ceremony would be the Cord awarding ceremony.

From my English dictionary:
Four·ra·gère - An ornamental braided cord usually looped around the left shoulder of a uniform, sometimes awarded to an entire military unit.

Most sources I have seen use the French word Fourragere without the French letter - è, but since Fourragère(s) is an English word for Cord(-s), I believe you may use the expression Cord or Cords awarding ceremony.

Hope this helps.

Christian · Post by **Christian** » Sat Apr 30, 2005 12:50 pm

Since Fourragère(s) is an English word for Cord(-s), I believe you may use the expression Cord or Cords awarding ceremony

Sorry Klemen, but this makes no sense at all.

Webster's Collegiate Dictionary (11th edition) recognizes Fourragère (Spelled correctly with the accent) and describes it as: "A braided cord worn usually around the left shoulder; esp: such a cord awarded as a decoration to a military unit".
Furthermore, Robert & Collins, French-English Dictionary, translates Fourragère with the same word.

If one looks up the noun "cord" in Webster's Collegiate, one will not find any reference whatsoever to a Fourragère. The only other possibility I could suggest would be lanyard ("a cord worn as a symbol of a military citation", however since Fourragère is widely recognized in English I would personally stick with that noun.

Cheers,

Christian

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Sun May 01, 2005 2:15 am

Hi Marc,

Try the following link, which explains the fourragere without attempting to translate it:

http://kilo35usmc.org/commem/fourragere.htm

Cheers,

Sid.

KlemenL · Post by **KlemenL** » Sun May 01, 2005 4:28 pm

Hi Christian!

My conviction that Fourragère can also be translated as Cord came from this website, which say:

Shoulders Need Love Too: The history of cords/fourrageres

By: C/ Capt. Nicholas Schaeffer

"What is that little rope on his shoulder and where does it come from?" I'm sure many cadets, new and old, have asked themselves this question. That "little rope" goes by many names: Cord, Fourragere, Aigullette, etc. Our detachment tends to use the terms Fourragere or Cord.

To understand this article of the uniform, you must first know some uniform history. Uniforms have been around for about 300 years. (They were first worn by papal guards in the Vatican). Since then, history records many modifications to the uniform, the majority originating from the French military in the mid-1700s.

The first recorded use of a device on the left shoulder is highly debated. Some think it was by knights who often had a rope wrapped around their left shoulder to tie up their horse. Others believed these same knights used a metal tipped throng to lace their armor, which conveniently hung over their left shoulder.

The fourragere was introduced to the United States Army uniform in 1832 by President Andrew Jackson. All general and staff officers were advised to wear a "twisted gold cord with gilt engraved tags worn on the right shoulder under the epaulette." Later uniform changes extended the wear of aigulettes to the general staff: the Adjutant General, the Inspector General, the aides-de-camp, the officers of the Quartermaster's, Subsistence, Pay and Medical Departments and the Commissary General of Purchases. Regimental staff also wore the same cords, but with silver and gold braiding.

Interesting fact: the fourragere is actually a unit citation. The cord with a hanging metal tip symbolized a hangman's rope and nail. It was believed that a unit would be threatened with death if they failed to do well in battle. This belief would later manifest itself during the War of 1870. Jails were often emptied and inmates were used to defend their city. These convicts would wrap the hangman's rope around their shoulder as a means of insignia and motivation. If the convicts succeeded, they were allowed to keep their lives and their hangman’s rope.

How can I get one of my own? Fourrageres are authorized to four organizations in AFROTC: detachment level honor guards, Arnold Air Society/Silver Wings, Pershing Rifles and Scabbard & Blade. Information on how to wear a fourragere can be found in section 10.8 - Shoulder Cords of AFMAN 36-2008. This manual and many others can be found on the detachment website at: http://afrotc.umd.edu/manual.htm.

URL: http://www.afrotc.umd.edu/OIG/OIG_Files ... rsion).htm

Hope this helps.

Christian · Post by **Christian** » Sun May 01, 2005 7:21 pm

Hi Klemen,

I see now why you made the recommendation.

While Capt. Schaeffer's detachment uses the terms Fourragère (This is the correct spelling according to Webster's Collegiate) and Cord interchangeably, this is incorrect from a point of view of basic meaning. Again, as I stated before, one can look up the noun cord in a dictionary and there is no reference to a Fourragère or a "cord awarded as a decoration to a military unit". In short, anybody who is not a member of Capt. Schaeffer's unit and who looks this up in a dictionary will be puzzled.

Aiguillette (and not Aigullette) is a shoulder cord worn by designated military aides and is probably not a good choice in Marc's case since this website is about the Paris Police Department.

I remain of the opinion that Fourragère is the best translation in this case.

Cheers,

Christian

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Mon May 02, 2005 12:27 am

Hi Christian,

I agree.

Cord is a generic term that can be applied to any twisted thread.

Aigulillettes seem to be a purely decorative uniform feature distinguishing senior staff functionaries.

Fourrageres seem to be an award, like a medal.

From the limited context you gave, "fourragere" looks like the right choice.

Cheers,

Sid.

P.S. Has "lanyard" been put forward as a possibility?

Christian · Post by **Christian** » Mon May 02, 2005 6:21 am

Hi Sid,

Yes, I suggested lanyard ("a cord worn as a symbol of a military citation") above.

Cheers,

Christian

Marc Binazzi · Post by **Marc Binazzi** » Mon May 02, 2005 10:36 am

Thanks to all for your precious advice and suggestions! It is very helpful.

Christian · Post by **Christian** » Mon May 02, 2005 1:27 pm

Marc,

No problem. If you have any other questions, please do not hesitate to ask.

Cheers,

Christian