A few points to a vast subject:
It is true that the Germans made fake transports to make the French believe that an attack on Switzerland in 1940 was imminent. If this would take place, an attack on France via the Jura mountains (Swiss-French Border) would of course outflank the Maginot line. This ruse worked. Paris and Berne were under the impressionn that 23 German Division were in Southern Germany. Actually there only were 10. Only 6 of these division were in the immediate vincinity of the Swiss border, not 16 as believed. But it is also a fact that the German High Command ordered the OB of Heeresgruppe C to made operational plans for a real attack on 26th June 1940 and these plans were prepared probably as a result of incidents in the Swiss airspace.
During June 1940 several air fights between German and Swiss aircraft in Swiss airspace took place. In the time from 1st to the 4th June, the Reich lost 4 bombers against one Swiss casualty. This resulted in harsh diplomatic protest from Berlin, which basically stated that German bombers had not flown into Swiss airspace. Military action would be imminent if no excuse would be forwarded for these "aggressions". On 8th June a punitive expedition was launched by the Germans, ordered by Göring himself: 32 Me 110 occupied Swiss airspace to demonstrate strength. 10 Swiss Me 109 attacked. Several Swiss machines were dammaged, but all returned to their homebase. At least 3 German aircraft were lost. Several left for the French airspace, burning. Hitler ordered the General of the 5th Fliegerkorps to report to the Führerhauptquartier in person. German protest increased. Then the Reich completely blocked off the coal deliveries (which was imported from Germay anyway). The Swiss Gorvenement complied: All interned pilots were freed. General Guisan had to abandon strict airspace protection: Only enemy aircraft flying deep into Swiss airspace were to attack by the Air Force. The Swiss Gouvernement appologized and was ready to pay the Germans for their lost aircraft. The "Frontisten" (Swiss Nazis), which had disbanded on their own only months ago were showing up again, the party, banned before, was permitted again (to again be banned on 19th November 1940 for good, its illegal successor, the "Nationalsozialistische Bewegung der Schweiz" was destroyed by a police action during June, 1941, the remainders, under strict Police observation, were useless, even in the eyes of the Reich, which branded them as loosers). Deliveries of war material to Germany were agreed on. Then came the speech of the Swiss Foreign Minister Pilet-Golaz and Chief of the Federal Council after the French fall, who spoke of "cooperation in a new Europe" and a "new European balance" and who asked to the Swiss people to follow their trusted Gouvernemnt blindly. This had quite the opposite effect: Switzerland is one of the rare direct democracies: The power is with the people (not their representatives) and the States and not with the Federal Governement. The demand to follow the Federal Council earned Pilet Golaz harsh critic in the Swiss Press. Swiss officers formed the pro Swiss "Gotthardbund" and plans were made for mutinity in case the Federal Council would capitulate. When later on these plans transpired, the General resisted all attempts by the Governement to remove the officeres from their posts and, after some token punishment, even granted them permission to contact him outside the chain of command in the future. The relationship between the Army and the Gorvernement remainded uneasy.
The Charité-sur-Loire papers are a different story: It was a very minute plan to defend Northwestern Switzerland with the help of the French army. After these plans were captured, both Berlin and Berne kept it secret. In Switzerland, the existence of this military pact transpired only during the sixties. On the Swiss side, probably only 10-12 persons were informed, among them Rudolf Minger as the only Member of the Federal Council (out of 7 members) and the General. But what is lesser known is the fact that the General had two groups of his Staff already in 1939 working on plans to defend Switzerland with the aid of Germany against a French attack and also with the aid of France against a German attack. This was of course also secret, but behind the screen of these actions, in the same time the real military convention the French was worked out and this was indeed top secret. It is obvious that in the case of the two parallel studies, neutrality had been preserved. This is also the case regarding the secret negotiations with France: Switzerland was and is kept by the Hague Convention to defend its territory with all means possible and it is free to decide which mesure are apropriate to achive this goal. Something even Swiss purists on neutrality tend to forget.
For further reading I can recommend Werner Rings, Die Schweiz im Krieg.
Cheers
Hans
Switzerland
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Hans Weber
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Hello Baltasar
Truth is in the eye of the beholder. The story is told in the book I mentioned in my post. The author is no amateur historian. He interviewed the Swiss pilots and had access to Swiss military documents. The Swiss excuse and the offer to pay for the dammage all exist in written form. There is no smoke without fire. There is a photo of one of the dammaged Me 109 in the book, landed by a wounded pilot. The Swiss were very carefull to credit the air victories, only 3 were acounted for sure kills as there were doubts if the others actually crashed (outside Switzerland). In June, the German losses amounted to 10 aircraft against 2 Swiss aircraft (one of them an unarmed observer). The Swiss Air Force shot down ca 50 planes during the war (including Allied aircraft). I will look up the exact number if need be. The Swiss were not too happy to have won this engagement against the invincible Luftwaffe and the German reaction forced them to reconsider and refrain from border patrols. Besides, the Germans were soon to learn the hard way that their Me 110 was no match for single engine fighters and that it had to be escorted by fighters. This short engagement was just a taste of what was to follow in the skies above Britain.
Cheers
Hans
Truth is in the eye of the beholder. The story is told in the book I mentioned in my post. The author is no amateur historian. He interviewed the Swiss pilots and had access to Swiss military documents. The Swiss excuse and the offer to pay for the dammage all exist in written form. There is no smoke without fire. There is a photo of one of the dammaged Me 109 in the book, landed by a wounded pilot. The Swiss were very carefull to credit the air victories, only 3 were acounted for sure kills as there were doubts if the others actually crashed (outside Switzerland). In June, the German losses amounted to 10 aircraft against 2 Swiss aircraft (one of them an unarmed observer). The Swiss Air Force shot down ca 50 planes during the war (including Allied aircraft). I will look up the exact number if need be. The Swiss were not too happy to have won this engagement against the invincible Luftwaffe and the German reaction forced them to reconsider and refrain from border patrols. Besides, the Germans were soon to learn the hard way that their Me 110 was no match for single engine fighters and that it had to be escorted by fighters. This short engagement was just a taste of what was to follow in the skies above Britain.
Cheers
Hans
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Enrico Cernuschi
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Gentlemen,
according my sources Hans is right again.
On 4 June 1940, anyway, the Swiss air force lost a Bf109D (Sublieutenant Rudolf Rickenbacher died) and on 8 June 1940 a biplane C-3S was destroyed by the German Bf 110 (Sublieutenant Rudolf Meuli and observer Lieut. Emil Guertler). Dulce et decorum est pro Patria mori.
I would like to know, too, if there was something true about the Italian fears according which Switzerland was planning with the French, in 1939, to let them cross his territory in view of a sudden, new Autumn 1939 pseudo-Nepoleonic Campaign of Italy.
This voice was credited at the hightest levels (The King) on Spring 1939.
Bye, EC
according my sources Hans is right again.
On 4 June 1940, anyway, the Swiss air force lost a Bf109D (Sublieutenant Rudolf Rickenbacher died) and on 8 June 1940 a biplane C-3S was destroyed by the German Bf 110 (Sublieutenant Rudolf Meuli and observer Lieut. Emil Guertler). Dulce et decorum est pro Patria mori.
I would like to know, too, if there was something true about the Italian fears according which Switzerland was planning with the French, in 1939, to let them cross his territory in view of a sudden, new Autumn 1939 pseudo-Nepoleonic Campaign of Italy.
This voice was credited at the hightest levels (The King) on Spring 1939.
Bye, EC
AA Kill Numbers
Anyone have a list of the numbers of planes from both sides that were shot down, or at least shot at by the Swiss? Did the Swiss give anyone "preferencial" treatment when it came to shooting them down?
Thank 'ya very much
-Rick
Thank 'ya very much
-Rick
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Hans Weber
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Hello Rick,
Numbers:
Werner Rings, Schweiz im Krieg, p.198. 251 eny airplanes neutralized, among them 58 crashed. Swiss losses: 4 airplanes in all. From the bombers forced to land in Switzerland 1618 men were interned.
There exists a study on each incident in bookfrom, but it's not my premier field of interest so maybe someone other can help you out here.
Jean-Pierre Thévoz in 39-45 magazine #178: In 1944 169 airplanes were neutralized, some of them on their own like 43 allied bombers which in three groups landed in March and April 44 on Swiss airports, all intact, each with 10 men on board, happy to end the war here and now. Some were forced to land like the 33 damaged bombers which crashlanded, among them 10 bombers shot down by Swiss AA guns or fighters. As the Swiss had no night fighting capabilities, during the night the AA guns protected the airspace. These brought them into conflict with the British bombers, flying over Switzerland to bomb Italy. During daytime, the fighters were engaged against American bombers mainly. As they flew Me 109 (and the French Morane 406) the Swiss painted large red and white strips not unlike the invasion strips on their planes so the Americans hopefully knew why these fighters wanted to escort them out of their airspace.
But action was also against the odd German airplane entering Swiss airspace. My dad remembers a Me 109 crashing not far from his home, shot down by Swiss fighters. My granddad was in the Ortswehr (militia) and remembered bringing in American pilots that had bailed out. Their expression changed from fear to happiness when learning that they had hit the jackpot by landing in Switzerland. The kids remembered them from handing out the obligatory chewing gum, of course. And from collecting the metallic strips released to fool radar which were all over the country. I never heard of Allied airmen beeing mistreated. They were interned which in short meant they had nothing to care for. After the war they were promptly released. German airmen were afaik seperated from Allied prisoners. The attitude against them was certainly colder, reflecting the general opinion in Switzerland, especially after 1942. During 1940 all of them captured so far were released due to pressure of the Reich (Germany just had to close down the coal delivery in violation of economic treaties, Switzerland has no port of its own, after all). Later on they didn't have much business to do in Switzerland and as the war didn't run well for them, they were not exactly in a good position to order the release of their strayed airmen anymore. There is an interesting episode of a brandnew Me 110 equipped with the latest ngihtfighting equipement landing in Switzerland on 28th April 1944. Because it was feared that this technology would fall in the hands of the Allies, OKW planned to engage Skorzeny's men to dynamite it. But then the case was solved in more civilized way: The Swiss blew up the airplane against a delivery of 12 new Me 109 G. Do I need to say that the airplanes didn't go beyond 15 flying hours, because of "mechnical troubles"? They sure look good on the ground, though. I've seen one of these birds in the Swiss Transportation museum in Lucerne and I have a photo of one, if anybody is interested in a scan.
Cheers
Hans
Numbers:
Werner Rings, Schweiz im Krieg, p.198. 251 eny airplanes neutralized, among them 58 crashed. Swiss losses: 4 airplanes in all. From the bombers forced to land in Switzerland 1618 men were interned.
There exists a study on each incident in bookfrom, but it's not my premier field of interest so maybe someone other can help you out here.
Jean-Pierre Thévoz in 39-45 magazine #178: In 1944 169 airplanes were neutralized, some of them on their own like 43 allied bombers which in three groups landed in March and April 44 on Swiss airports, all intact, each with 10 men on board, happy to end the war here and now. Some were forced to land like the 33 damaged bombers which crashlanded, among them 10 bombers shot down by Swiss AA guns or fighters. As the Swiss had no night fighting capabilities, during the night the AA guns protected the airspace. These brought them into conflict with the British bombers, flying over Switzerland to bomb Italy. During daytime, the fighters were engaged against American bombers mainly. As they flew Me 109 (and the French Morane 406) the Swiss painted large red and white strips not unlike the invasion strips on their planes so the Americans hopefully knew why these fighters wanted to escort them out of their airspace.
But action was also against the odd German airplane entering Swiss airspace. My dad remembers a Me 109 crashing not far from his home, shot down by Swiss fighters. My granddad was in the Ortswehr (militia) and remembered bringing in American pilots that had bailed out. Their expression changed from fear to happiness when learning that they had hit the jackpot by landing in Switzerland. The kids remembered them from handing out the obligatory chewing gum, of course. And from collecting the metallic strips released to fool radar which were all over the country. I never heard of Allied airmen beeing mistreated. They were interned which in short meant they had nothing to care for. After the war they were promptly released. German airmen were afaik seperated from Allied prisoners. The attitude against them was certainly colder, reflecting the general opinion in Switzerland, especially after 1942. During 1940 all of them captured so far were released due to pressure of the Reich (Germany just had to close down the coal delivery in violation of economic treaties, Switzerland has no port of its own, after all). Later on they didn't have much business to do in Switzerland and as the war didn't run well for them, they were not exactly in a good position to order the release of their strayed airmen anymore. There is an interesting episode of a brandnew Me 110 equipped with the latest ngihtfighting equipement landing in Switzerland on 28th April 1944. Because it was feared that this technology would fall in the hands of the Allies, OKW planned to engage Skorzeny's men to dynamite it. But then the case was solved in more civilized way: The Swiss blew up the airplane against a delivery of 12 new Me 109 G. Do I need to say that the airplanes didn't go beyond 15 flying hours, because of "mechnical troubles"? They sure look good on the ground, though. I've seen one of these birds in the Swiss Transportation museum in Lucerne and I have a photo of one, if anybody is interested in a scan.
Cheers
Hans