can anyone identify this German medal

warspoils · Post by **warspoils** » Sat Oct 27, 2007 1:32 pm

Hi, with the bow ribbon this was most likley awarded to a Woman, but I can not find any information, can anybody help

regards
Jeff

Blackie · Post by **Blackie** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 4:04 pm

I have shown this to a number of people, German and other various 'experts'. The inscription says "For Service" but no one new for what. Speculation is that it is a religous artifact from the period between 1918 and 1933. No one thought it was issued by any German government or during the Nazi period.

phylo_roadking · Post by **phylo_roadking** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 4:30 pm

Jeff, is that actually two stylised children at the bottom of the outer ring??? If so - they're wearing stylised DUTCH hats, and there's a CROWN at the top...very possibly NOT German at all?

Paddy Keating · Post by **Paddy Keating** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 4:36 pm

It's a Prussian crown...

phylo_roadking · Post by **phylo_roadking** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:19 pm

Would the crown have stopped being applied to medals/awards after 1918?

Paddy Keating · Post by **Paddy Keating** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:29 pm

In general, yes. However, there were retrospective awards made by various states, including Prussia, well into the 1920s, the awards themselves being available through retail outlets. I believe that Kaiser Wilhelm II awarded various orders and decorations during his time in exile, as did other German royals and nobles. This medal looks very like some sort of quasi-official nursing or health/medical association merit or service award. It could even be for some children's charity covered by royal warrant, hence the use of the crown. I would venture a guess that the horizontal pin on the medal itself was to prevent it dangling and being a nuisance, which very much suggests that it was intended for everyday wear on a nurse's uniform. It reminds me of some nurses' watches, with double-pin set-ups for that reason.

PK

phylo_roadking · Post by **phylo_roadking** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:38 pm

I believe that Kaiser Wilhelm II awarded various orders and decorations during his time in exile

Given the stylised blue enamel chidren and their hats, and his location during those years, could he have made any to Dutch holders or organisations?

Paddy Keating · Post by **Paddy Keating** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:45 pm

Got it!

It appears to be a variation of the Frauen-Verdienstkreuz, which was extant from 1907 to 1918.

Huesken

This picture shows a different type of crown and is described as the 2nd Form. However, it is very clearly described as a Prussian award.

Huesken

This is the Frauen-Verdienstkreuz in Silber 1er Form. Huesken has it priced at €1,200.00. The Gold class is €3,300.00.

Hope this brings you closer to finding out what exactly you have.

PK

Paddy Keating · Post by **Paddy Keating** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:52 pm

phylo_roadking wrote:
I believe that Kaiser Wilhelm II awarded various orders and decorations during his time in exile
Given the stylised blue enamel chidren and their hats, and his location during those years, could he have made any to Dutch holders or organisations?

Would you not say, upon closer examination, that what certainly appears to be two Wizard of Oz-style children in silhouette dancing along is in fact Wilhelm's royal cypher or, at any rate, a revised version of it? Unless this award turns out to be some sort of copy or fake, it is quite feasible that the exiled Emperor commissioned some Frauen-Verdienstkreuze with his imperial Prussian crown sometime in the 1920s for award to faithful female retainers, courtiers and friends. Why, after all, would fakers put so much effort into making something of this obvious quality and get the crown so wrong?

PK

Paddy Keating · Post by **Paddy Keating** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:54 pm

The reverse of the FVKiS from André Huesken's site and Jeff's medal.

phylo_roadking · Post by **phylo_roadking** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 6:32 pm

In the better pics the cypher shows up much more clearly. Why then the difference between the difference between the Prussian Crown in the Forn A and from B types, from the crown on Geoff's type? It's quite a considerable difference yet clearly modelled on something, rather than just a bastardised version of the original.

phylo_roadking · Post by **phylo_roadking** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 6:37 pm

Just been looking around; Jeff's "crown" is not dissimilar to the German State Crown, modelled in 1871 but never made. Those arched panels in the coronet ring look not unlike. According to Wiki, that crown rather then the Crown of the Hohenzollerns was used by the Kaisers as a heraldic device.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_State_Crown

Paddy Keating · Post by **Paddy Keating** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 5:47 am

It's essentially this crown, known amongst collectors as "the Prussian crown". As you say, this design appeared in 1871 on various insignia, documents and other objects. The crown on the FVK looks more like that seen on the Iron Cross whereas this design was used on Flight Badges, naval officers' caps and other insignia, like the WW1 U-Boat Badge, instituted in January 1918 by the Kaiser.

PK